How to safeguard your time for scholarship

1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:05,860 Welcome to the Clinician Researcher podcast, where academic clinicians learn the skills 2 00:00:05,860 --> 00:00:11,260 to build their own research program, whether or not they have a mentor. 3 00:00:11,260 --> 00:00:17,340 As clinicians, we spend a decade or more as trainees learning to take care of patients. 4 00:00:17,340 --> 00:00:22,380 When we finally start our careers, we want to build research programs, but then we find 5 00:00:22,380 --> 00:00:27,780 that our years of clinical training did not adequately prepare us to lead our research 6 00:00:27,780 --> 00:00:29,200 program. 7 00:00:29,200 --> 00:00:35,480 Through no fault of our own, we struggle to find mentors, and when we can't, we quit. 8 00:00:35,480 --> 00:00:40,580 However, clinicians hold the keys to the greatest research breakthroughs. 9 00:00:40,580 --> 00:00:46,200 For this reason, the Clinician Researcher podcast exists to give academic clinicians 10 00:00:46,200 --> 00:00:51,800 the tools to build their own research program, whether or not they have a mentor. 11 00:00:51,800 --> 00:01:01,100 Now introducing your host, Toyosi Onwuemene. 12 00:01:01,100 --> 00:01:03,260 Welcome to the Clinician Researcher podcast. 13 00:01:03,260 --> 00:01:07,840 I'm your host, Toyosi Onwuemene, and it is such a pleasure to be talking with you today. 14 00:01:07,840 --> 00:01:11,680 Thank you for tuning in, for taking the time to be here today, because if you were not 15 00:01:11,680 --> 00:01:14,100 here, I would not be here talking. 16 00:01:14,100 --> 00:01:16,400 So, yes, thank you for tuning in. 17 00:01:16,400 --> 00:01:21,880 Today I am talking about how to safeguard time for scholarship, how to safeguard your 18 00:01:21,880 --> 00:01:24,360 time for scholarship. 19 00:01:24,360 --> 00:01:31,680 And the reason behind this podcast is a recent conversation I had with a group of peers, 20 00:01:31,680 --> 00:01:35,200 and we were talking about challenges that we're experiencing and moving our research 21 00:01:35,200 --> 00:01:36,620 forward. 22 00:01:36,620 --> 00:01:42,720 And somebody said, yeah, you know, the requirement at our hospital is that everybody has to be 23 00:01:42,720 --> 00:01:48,200 in their inbox and respond to any MyChart message within, I forget, whether it was 20 24 00:01:48,200 --> 00:01:51,200 minutes or something of it being sent. 25 00:01:51,200 --> 00:01:56,280 And I had to start laughing when I heard that because it reminded me of a situation when 26 00:01:56,280 --> 00:02:04,840 I first started my faculty career where I really believed every rule was law. 27 00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:06,960 Everything they said I had to do, I would do. 28 00:02:06,960 --> 00:02:09,160 Only physicians can call prior authorizations. 29 00:02:09,160 --> 00:02:13,360 Well, okay, only physicians can write orders for calcium. 30 00:02:13,360 --> 00:02:18,200 Okay, I believed everything I was told. 31 00:02:18,200 --> 00:02:24,560 And I recognize now in retrospect that believing everything you're told doesn't work for children, 32 00:02:24,560 --> 00:02:28,000 and it certainly doesn't work for adults, right? 33 00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:32,400 Eventually you have to wake up and start to recognize that not everything you're told 34 00:02:32,400 --> 00:02:33,400 should be believed. 35 00:02:33,400 --> 00:02:39,140 And, you know, going back to the initial conversation we were having, it's like, well, if you 36 00:02:39,140 --> 00:02:43,800 have to respond to any message within 20 minutes of it being sent, that means you're literally 37 00:02:43,800 --> 00:02:50,400 going to be in MyChart checking messages all the time, and that doesn't foster good patient 38 00:02:50,400 --> 00:02:55,600 care because clearly you have more to do beyond just checking MyChart messages when it comes 39 00:02:55,600 --> 00:02:58,760 to taking care of patients and certainly when it comes to taking care of leading a research 40 00:02:58,760 --> 00:02:59,920 program. 41 00:02:59,920 --> 00:03:05,200 And so I just want to pause and talk about how to safeguard your time for scholarship. 42 00:03:05,200 --> 00:03:10,640 I'm going to just talk about seven things that you need to think about as you are moving 43 00:03:10,640 --> 00:03:12,600 forward to do scholarship. 44 00:03:12,600 --> 00:03:16,480 Now the first thing I do want to share is that if you are at an academic medical center, 45 00:03:16,480 --> 00:03:22,400 no matter your title, so maybe you're a clinician or you're a clinician educator or you're a 46 00:03:22,400 --> 00:03:27,940 clinician scientist or a research scientist, no matter your title, if you are part of an 47 00:03:27,940 --> 00:03:34,280 academic medical center, there is a baseline expectation that you're contributing to scholarship. 48 00:03:34,280 --> 00:03:38,920 And now the requirements for scholarship depend on what you've agreed to in taking on your 49 00:03:38,920 --> 00:03:39,920 job. 50 00:03:39,920 --> 00:03:45,320 Now for many of you in my community, you are clinicians who are trying to make that transition 51 00:03:45,320 --> 00:03:49,680 from clinician to clinician scientist or clinician researcher. 52 00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:53,440 Some of you have already made that transition where you're primarily a clinician scientist 53 00:03:53,440 --> 00:03:57,600 and some of you are probably just already like fully research scientists. 54 00:03:57,600 --> 00:04:03,240 But no matter what, scholarship is part of your portfolio as part of an academic medical 55 00:04:03,240 --> 00:04:04,240 center. 56 00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:08,680 So even if you are fully clinical, there's an expectation that you contribute to scholarship 57 00:04:08,680 --> 00:04:14,080 either in taking on trainees within your program, teaching a few lectures. 58 00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:18,680 There's an expectation that there'll be some publications, even if it's not kind of like 59 00:04:18,680 --> 00:04:25,800 the highest expectation as would maybe be required of someone who's a clinician, who 60 00:04:25,800 --> 00:04:31,880 is a scientist only or a clinician scientist who has got most of their time protected for 61 00:04:31,880 --> 00:04:32,880 research. 62 00:04:32,880 --> 00:04:38,080 So scholarship is an inherent piece of being at an academic medical center. 63 00:04:38,080 --> 00:04:41,520 And so there's always got to be time for scholarship. 64 00:04:41,520 --> 00:04:46,120 Sometimes I'll hear people say, well, you have 20% protective time for scholarship. 65 00:04:46,120 --> 00:04:51,280 And to be honest, that's not really real because if you are in clinic four days a week, 20% 66 00:04:51,280 --> 00:04:55,100 of that time is time to finish your administrative tasks. 67 00:04:55,100 --> 00:04:57,600 That's not protected time for research. 68 00:04:57,600 --> 00:05:03,040 And to be honest, anybody who says that is protected time is not being sincere. 69 00:05:03,040 --> 00:05:04,440 But that's not where we're going today. 70 00:05:04,440 --> 00:05:08,720 Today we're talking about, well, how do you safeguard your time for scholarship no matter 71 00:05:08,720 --> 00:05:09,720 what? 72 00:05:09,720 --> 00:05:14,000 Because even if you are, as long as you have any clinical experience, as long as you have 73 00:05:14,000 --> 00:05:20,400 any clinical training, there's always an expectation that you're going to be able to manage and 74 00:05:20,400 --> 00:05:21,400 take care of patients. 75 00:05:21,400 --> 00:05:27,240 As long as you have any clinical responsibility, you want to protect the time that you don't 76 00:05:27,240 --> 00:05:31,000 have clinical responsibility to move forward in scholarship. 77 00:05:31,000 --> 00:05:32,800 And why do you need to do this? 78 00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:38,560 You need to do it because otherwise you're going to spend your whole time doing things 79 00:05:38,560 --> 00:05:43,160 that are surrounding patient care, not necessarily directly related to patient care, but you're 80 00:05:43,160 --> 00:05:45,680 not going to be able to move other things forward. 81 00:05:45,680 --> 00:05:49,800 And then when it comes to time to doing your scholarship, then you're kind of biting into 82 00:05:49,800 --> 00:05:52,420 your nights and weekends to try to get that done. 83 00:05:52,420 --> 00:05:54,440 And that doesn't make for healthy living. 84 00:05:54,440 --> 00:05:57,400 And so that's not what I'm primarily recommending. 85 00:05:57,400 --> 00:06:01,640 So how do you do that where your scholarship is part of your daytime activities? 86 00:06:01,640 --> 00:06:02,640 Okay. 87 00:06:02,640 --> 00:06:06,640 So the first thing I want to share is that you have to recognize that the rules of any 88 00:06:06,640 --> 00:06:09,560 system are agnostic to your needs, right? 89 00:06:09,560 --> 00:06:15,040 The system is not thinking, oh, what does this person need to best succeed? 90 00:06:15,040 --> 00:06:21,180 Ideally, right, systems are built to think about those who work within them and make 91 00:06:21,180 --> 00:06:24,440 sure that they are healthy and they're well cared for. 92 00:06:24,440 --> 00:06:31,200 But in reality, academic medical centers are really places of extreme contradiction, right? 93 00:06:31,200 --> 00:06:36,680 Academics is important, scholarship matters, but also 100% attention to patient care, but 94 00:06:36,680 --> 00:06:40,320 also 100% attention to education. 95 00:06:40,320 --> 00:06:44,880 And to be honest, sometimes those things actually are in conflict. 96 00:06:44,880 --> 00:06:50,720 And so if you have a system where all these things are in conflict, then no one in the 97 00:06:50,720 --> 00:06:55,600 system is thinking, well, how do I help the clinician who is trying to build a research 98 00:06:55,600 --> 00:06:56,600 program? 99 00:06:56,600 --> 00:06:58,340 How do I make sure that they're okay? 100 00:06:58,340 --> 00:07:02,800 If you are in a situation where people are actively in your system thinking about you 101 00:07:02,800 --> 00:07:07,120 as they're making up the rules, kudos to you. 102 00:07:07,120 --> 00:07:08,160 And congratulations. 103 00:07:08,160 --> 00:07:11,680 And please send us a message about where you are because we need to know. 104 00:07:11,680 --> 00:07:13,600 It's a unique situation. 105 00:07:13,600 --> 00:07:18,640 What's most realistic, what happens more likely, is that those who are in charge of the clinical 106 00:07:18,640 --> 00:07:20,800 things are making the rules for clinical things. 107 00:07:20,800 --> 00:07:24,960 And those who are in charge of scholarship are making the rules in terms of what's needed 108 00:07:24,960 --> 00:07:26,500 for a scholarship. 109 00:07:26,500 --> 00:07:30,760 Those who are in administration are making the rules that's best for them in administration. 110 00:07:30,760 --> 00:07:35,000 Those who are educating trainees are making rules as far as what's best for the education 111 00:07:35,000 --> 00:07:36,000 of trainees. 112 00:07:36,000 --> 00:07:40,280 And they don't all go together to help you move forward. 113 00:07:40,280 --> 00:07:45,840 But it's important to recognize that the system is agnostic. 114 00:07:45,840 --> 00:07:47,480 It doesn't know what your needs are. 115 00:07:47,480 --> 00:07:50,520 It has no idea what you need. 116 00:07:50,520 --> 00:07:55,600 And so that's the first thing just to say, no one's out to get you. 117 00:07:55,600 --> 00:07:56,740 No one's out to get you. 118 00:07:56,740 --> 00:08:01,560 It's just the system works to support the system in the silos in which the system exists. 119 00:08:01,560 --> 00:08:06,240 So you just have to recognize that if it's not working for you, it's not because anyone's 120 00:08:06,240 --> 00:08:07,800 out to get you. 121 00:08:07,800 --> 00:08:09,880 It's just because the system is agnostic. 122 00:08:09,880 --> 00:08:18,840 It has no idea who you are in its systemic and its need to take care of its own issues. 123 00:08:18,840 --> 00:08:23,440 The second thing is that the system is not built to care for your needs. 124 00:08:23,440 --> 00:08:25,220 This is different from number one. 125 00:08:25,220 --> 00:08:28,480 So number one is that the rules is agnostic. 126 00:08:28,480 --> 00:08:31,300 It just doesn't care for you one way or the other. 127 00:08:31,300 --> 00:08:36,720 But number two is very clearly when it comes to your mental health, your emotional health, 128 00:08:36,720 --> 00:08:40,640 your well-being, OK, the system is not built to do that for you. 129 00:08:40,640 --> 00:08:45,640 It's really great that at many institutions, there's like personal psychological services 130 00:08:45,640 --> 00:08:48,080 that are available to you in case you're stressed. 131 00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:49,320 That's all well and good. 132 00:08:49,320 --> 00:08:54,800 But what I'm talking about is a system that's inherently structured to care personally for 133 00:08:54,800 --> 00:09:00,640 the clinician or the clinician scientist or the clinician who's trying to build a research 134 00:09:00,640 --> 00:09:03,480 program or a program of scholarship. 135 00:09:03,480 --> 00:09:06,040 It is not built to care for your needs. 136 00:09:06,040 --> 00:09:11,600 It's not there to say, wow, this attending, this clinician has rounded for the last seven 137 00:09:11,600 --> 00:09:12,600 days. 138 00:09:12,600 --> 00:09:15,800 Let's build in a day of rest following seven days of rounding. 139 00:09:15,800 --> 00:09:17,040 Oh, no, no, no. 140 00:09:17,040 --> 00:09:20,880 There's none of that. 141 00:09:20,880 --> 00:09:21,880 No one wants to know. 142 00:09:21,880 --> 00:09:22,880 No one's asking you. 143 00:09:22,880 --> 00:09:25,040 No one's saying, oh, yeah, you work seven days. 144 00:09:25,040 --> 00:09:26,960 Oh, of course, you should take time off. 145 00:09:26,960 --> 00:09:29,000 Barely anybody is doing that. 146 00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:35,760 And that's why number three is that the best person equipped to handle your needs is you. 147 00:09:35,760 --> 00:09:37,840 OK, we've agreed. 148 00:09:37,840 --> 00:09:40,480 We've said that the system is not there. 149 00:09:40,480 --> 00:09:41,720 It's agnostic to your needs. 150 00:09:41,720 --> 00:09:43,760 It's not there to care for you. 151 00:09:43,760 --> 00:09:49,440 And so if somebody is going to say, hey, what's going on with Toyosi? 152 00:09:49,440 --> 00:09:53,720 What does she need after seven days of rounding nonstop in the hospital? 153 00:09:53,720 --> 00:10:00,280 Well, the chances are high that you're going to need to take the leadership, take the leadership 154 00:10:00,280 --> 00:10:03,080 of caring personally for yourself. 155 00:10:03,080 --> 00:10:07,880 And so when it comes to your scholarship and safeguarding your scholarship, you're going 156 00:10:07,880 --> 00:10:12,440 to need to take the lead because you're the best equipped person to do that. 157 00:10:12,440 --> 00:10:13,440 Right. 158 00:10:13,440 --> 00:10:15,240 The system is not built for you. 159 00:10:15,240 --> 00:10:18,000 I mean, it's agnostic to your needs. 160 00:10:18,000 --> 00:10:22,160 It has no idea what you need, but you have exactly what you need. 161 00:10:22,160 --> 00:10:24,080 You know, you know what you need. 162 00:10:24,080 --> 00:10:29,160 And so you could wait and say, well, they'll figure out that I'm tired and then someone's 163 00:10:29,160 --> 00:10:30,840 going to give me a day off. 164 00:10:30,840 --> 00:10:36,580 You can wait for that or you can say, hmm, they may or may not figure out that I'm tired. 165 00:10:36,580 --> 00:10:41,400 And so why don't I just take the rest that I need and figure out a way to do that. 166 00:10:41,400 --> 00:10:42,400 Right. 167 00:10:42,400 --> 00:10:47,400 And so the person that's best equipped to handle your needs as you will always be you. 168 00:10:47,400 --> 00:10:52,480 And I'm glad it's you because fortunately, you know, no one cares about your needs more 169 00:10:52,480 --> 00:10:53,480 than you do. 170 00:10:53,480 --> 00:10:56,120 Actually, maybe your mother, if she's still alive, right. 171 00:10:56,120 --> 00:10:59,880 Your mother, maybe your dad, a parent. 172 00:10:59,880 --> 00:11:00,880 Right. 173 00:11:00,880 --> 00:11:04,600 But other than the parent and especially now that you're in the academic medical center, 174 00:11:04,600 --> 00:11:05,600 it's you. 175 00:11:05,600 --> 00:11:09,200 And so and so take ownership, take ownership. 176 00:11:09,200 --> 00:11:10,200 OK. 177 00:11:10,200 --> 00:11:14,520 Number four is if you can't make headway, reach out to your mentors. 178 00:11:14,520 --> 00:11:16,440 This is the benefit of having mentors. 179 00:11:16,440 --> 00:11:17,440 Right. 180 00:11:17,440 --> 00:11:20,320 The benefit of having mentors is that sometimes you can't figure things out or sometimes you 181 00:11:20,320 --> 00:11:23,600 don't even know who to turn to or sometimes you know who to turn to. 182 00:11:23,600 --> 00:11:27,640 And they're just, you know, they're just not really supporting you like they're supposed 183 00:11:27,640 --> 00:11:28,640 to. 184 00:11:28,640 --> 00:11:32,760 So the benefit of having people you can reach out to and say, hey, this is not working. 185 00:11:32,760 --> 00:11:36,680 Hey, how do I manage this thing where I've been on call for seven days, but there's no 186 00:11:36,680 --> 00:11:39,520 time built in my schedule for me to take time off. 187 00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:41,760 This is where mentors can support you. 188 00:11:41,760 --> 00:11:43,600 It doesn't mean they're going to go to bat for you. 189 00:11:43,600 --> 00:11:47,760 Many of them don't necessarily do that, but at least they'll give you advice and say, 190 00:11:47,760 --> 00:11:50,200 oh, yeah, of course. 191 00:11:50,200 --> 00:11:53,760 After you've been on service for seven days, you can take a day off on your own. 192 00:11:53,760 --> 00:11:56,720 And this is who you tell or it doesn't matter who you tell. 193 00:11:56,720 --> 00:11:59,840 But you know, they give you ideas for how they manage it. 194 00:11:59,840 --> 00:12:02,640 And hopefully they're healthy in the way they live their lives so that they can give you 195 00:12:02,640 --> 00:12:05,080 advice that's healthy for you. 196 00:12:05,080 --> 00:12:09,460 And but even if they're not, you'll catch a clue based on what they say, how they're 197 00:12:09,460 --> 00:12:11,160 thinking about these things. 198 00:12:11,160 --> 00:12:12,680 But definitely reach out. 199 00:12:12,680 --> 00:12:17,300 Even if it's a mentor who's outside your institution and they don't necessarily have any pull within 200 00:12:17,300 --> 00:12:21,560 your institution, they can still give you advice that's helpful for you, that helps 201 00:12:21,560 --> 00:12:22,880 you move forward. 202 00:12:22,880 --> 00:12:28,400 So if you cannot make headway in safeguarding time for your scholarship, this is where you 203 00:12:28,400 --> 00:12:33,160 really can make good use of your mentors, both internal mentors and external mentors 204 00:12:33,160 --> 00:12:34,960 as well. 205 00:12:34,960 --> 00:12:36,480 OK. 206 00:12:36,480 --> 00:12:40,240 Number five is to carefully craft the career you want. 207 00:12:40,240 --> 00:12:47,520 Now, remember at the story at the beginning, I told you the story of a young person who's 208 00:12:47,520 --> 00:12:51,620 part of a peer mentoring group who's like, well, the requirement of the institution is 209 00:12:51,620 --> 00:12:57,760 that within 15 to 20 minutes of any message being sent, it needs to be responded to. 210 00:12:57,760 --> 00:13:06,760 And you know, I imagine that if we actually trace that rule back to the person who reportedly 211 00:13:06,760 --> 00:13:12,800 said it, we will find out that maybe it was contextual or maybe it was a specific situation 212 00:13:12,800 --> 00:13:15,440 in which they said that needed to happen. 213 00:13:15,440 --> 00:13:20,680 But as with all urban legends, you know, it starts with a little kernel of truth and then 214 00:13:20,680 --> 00:13:26,720 it's exaggerated and then it's distorted and then it becomes this amazing story that's 215 00:13:26,720 --> 00:13:31,160 really hard to believe, especially when you know the system well. 216 00:13:31,160 --> 00:13:37,000 And so you don't want to take everything at face value and say, well, this is the requirement. 217 00:13:37,000 --> 00:13:39,400 You want to ask, is it really the requirement? 218 00:13:39,400 --> 00:13:40,400 Is it really? 219 00:13:40,400 --> 00:13:46,240 Because if it is the requirement for me to be in the epic messaging all day and well, 220 00:13:46,240 --> 00:13:49,320 I guess until, you know, maybe in this case, it was an infusion center. 221 00:13:49,320 --> 00:13:54,320 Okay, maybe until the infusion center closes, then I have to ask, so when am I doing my 222 00:13:54,320 --> 00:13:56,040 charting? 223 00:13:56,040 --> 00:13:58,480 When am I doing my scholarship? 224 00:13:58,480 --> 00:14:00,840 When am I doing my resident education? 225 00:14:00,840 --> 00:14:01,840 Right. 226 00:14:01,840 --> 00:14:03,400 These are the questions you ask. 227 00:14:03,400 --> 00:14:07,840 And instead of like internalizing it all and saying, okay, I'll just move it to the night. 228 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:09,560 I'll just push sleep out of the way. 229 00:14:09,560 --> 00:14:16,000 Instead of doing that, you ask, hmm, what do I want for my experience so that I can 230 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:20,000 show up well in the other things for which I'm called to do. 231 00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:21,000 Right. 232 00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:26,600 I mean, you're called to the institution to see patients, to, you know, take care of patients, 233 00:14:26,600 --> 00:14:33,560 close charts, to lead an academic experience, to take care of the trainees who are coming 234 00:14:33,560 --> 00:14:34,960 through your program to teach. 235 00:14:34,960 --> 00:14:37,840 Like, you have a job description. 236 00:14:37,840 --> 00:14:38,840 It's very clear. 237 00:14:38,840 --> 00:14:42,800 I mean, you may not be clear about what your job description is, but the requirements are 238 00:14:42,800 --> 00:14:45,300 usually set forth in the AP&T handbook. 239 00:14:45,300 --> 00:14:49,760 So that's the, you know, promotions and tenure handbook. 240 00:14:49,760 --> 00:14:52,840 Usually it's like these are the requirements to be promoted. 241 00:14:52,840 --> 00:14:56,240 And that usually tells you about what's valued at your institution, what you're supposed 242 00:14:56,240 --> 00:14:57,240 to be doing. 243 00:14:57,240 --> 00:15:00,800 And so if you look at all these rules and they're not supporting you in the way that 244 00:15:00,800 --> 00:15:07,720 the institution says you should be moving forward, then you decide how to best help 245 00:15:07,720 --> 00:15:10,600 your institution get what they want out of you. 246 00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:14,000 Because if at the end of three years of being at your institution, you're like, well, I 247 00:15:14,000 --> 00:15:19,840 was so busy in my chart, I didn't really have a chance to close all my patient charts, or 248 00:15:19,840 --> 00:15:22,960 I didn't really have a chance to do any scholarship. 249 00:15:22,960 --> 00:15:27,520 It's like you actually have not progressed like you're supposed to, and people will let 250 00:15:27,520 --> 00:15:28,720 you know that. 251 00:15:28,720 --> 00:15:32,440 And you cannot use the excuse of like, well, if you hadn't made this rule about my chart, 252 00:15:32,440 --> 00:15:34,040 I would be better. 253 00:15:34,040 --> 00:15:40,940 It's not, don't wait three years to try to ask someone, you know, how to move forward 254 00:15:40,940 --> 00:15:42,880 in a rule that doesn't help you. 255 00:15:42,880 --> 00:15:46,080 You decide, you decide, you've got to decide. 256 00:15:46,080 --> 00:15:47,960 Like this is the career I want. 257 00:15:47,960 --> 00:15:49,800 This is how I want to move forward. 258 00:15:49,800 --> 00:15:55,120 Therefore this rule that keeps me in my chart day and night, let's figure out a way to fix 259 00:15:55,120 --> 00:15:56,120 it. 260 00:15:56,120 --> 00:15:57,120 Right? 261 00:15:57,120 --> 00:15:58,120 So this is important for you to think about. 262 00:15:58,120 --> 00:15:59,120 Okay. 263 00:15:59,120 --> 00:16:03,040 The next thing to do is to help your senior leaders understand why it's best to support 264 00:16:03,040 --> 00:16:04,040 you. 265 00:16:04,040 --> 00:16:07,640 Again, going back to I don't know what the origin of this story is, people will say, 266 00:16:07,640 --> 00:16:09,320 oh, the senior leadership wants this. 267 00:16:09,320 --> 00:16:15,360 And you know, many times senior leadership, they say things and the things they say are 268 00:16:15,360 --> 00:16:17,200 carried out of proportion. 269 00:16:17,200 --> 00:16:23,460 And all of a sudden people are saying, people are making changes to their academic experience 270 00:16:23,460 --> 00:16:28,720 or to their patient care based on what somebody may have said in an off comment or off the 271 00:16:28,720 --> 00:16:30,640 record in passing. 272 00:16:30,640 --> 00:16:31,640 Right? 273 00:16:31,640 --> 00:16:33,320 And this is the challenge of leadership. 274 00:16:33,320 --> 00:16:38,320 You do not recognize how much influence your word carries. 275 00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:42,400 The moment you say something, even if you were just joking, even if you were just thinking 276 00:16:42,400 --> 00:16:47,160 it through, people are apt to respond to it and then to tell other people that, oh, this 277 00:16:47,160 --> 00:16:48,760 is what the boss wants. 278 00:16:48,760 --> 00:16:50,840 This is what the leadership wants. 279 00:16:50,840 --> 00:16:53,280 And it may not even be what the leadership wants. 280 00:16:53,280 --> 00:16:57,920 And so it's an opportunity to go before your leadership, whether that's your division chief 281 00:16:57,920 --> 00:17:03,200 or your department chair and say, hey, I heard that there's this new rule that keeps us in 282 00:17:03,200 --> 00:17:05,040 my chart all the time. 283 00:17:05,040 --> 00:17:06,040 Hmm. 284 00:17:06,040 --> 00:17:07,880 What were you thinking when you made this rule? 285 00:17:07,880 --> 00:17:08,880 Right? 286 00:17:08,880 --> 00:17:14,920 And then you really get to understand what was the intent behind the communication, what 287 00:17:14,920 --> 00:17:17,280 is realistic, what is expected. 288 00:17:17,280 --> 00:17:22,620 And if they're completely oblivious, right, because many leaders in physician organizations 289 00:17:22,620 --> 00:17:26,640 now are not necessarily physicians and they don't understand the impact of some of the 290 00:17:26,640 --> 00:17:31,880 requirements that they're bringing forth, you help them understand to say, well, if 291 00:17:31,880 --> 00:17:36,920 you are optimizing for me being in my chart, here are all the things that you're not optimizing 292 00:17:36,920 --> 00:17:44,520 for and you help people see that whatever regulations or whatever rules are being promulgated 293 00:17:44,520 --> 00:17:50,300 or being made up are not supporting you so that they can decide if they need to reinterpret 294 00:17:50,300 --> 00:17:54,960 the rules, if they need to clarify things for you, if they need to say, hey, we thought 295 00:17:54,960 --> 00:17:57,360 it was a great idea, clearly not a great idea. 296 00:17:57,360 --> 00:18:00,120 We did not mean to X, Y, Z. 297 00:18:00,120 --> 00:18:04,680 And so you're really helping your senior leaders support you and helping them understand why 298 00:18:04,680 --> 00:18:05,800 it's best to support you. 299 00:18:05,800 --> 00:18:08,200 It's like, well, this doesn't meet the mission. 300 00:18:08,200 --> 00:18:10,400 This doesn't help the bottom line. 301 00:18:10,400 --> 00:18:15,840 This is what helps me move forward in a way that supports you and your role as a leader. 302 00:18:15,840 --> 00:18:20,460 And so you help your senior leaders understand why it's best to support you rather than just 303 00:18:20,460 --> 00:18:23,060 making rules that actually don't help you move forward. 304 00:18:23,060 --> 00:18:26,840 And what I see a lot of people doing, especially people who are underrepresented in the academy 305 00:18:26,840 --> 00:18:29,560 doing is just resisting, right? 306 00:18:29,560 --> 00:18:32,120 We're not going to say, we're not going to face it head on. 307 00:18:32,120 --> 00:18:34,040 We're just not going to do this thing. 308 00:18:34,040 --> 00:18:36,720 And you got to do what works for you. 309 00:18:36,720 --> 00:18:43,200 But if you can, it's always useful to have these conversations so that the people who 310 00:18:43,200 --> 00:18:48,500 are making these rules are connected to the consequences of the rules that they're making. 311 00:18:48,500 --> 00:18:53,240 So do what's necessary, but you help your senior leaders understand why it is in their 312 00:18:53,240 --> 00:18:55,480 best interest to support you. 313 00:18:55,480 --> 00:18:59,540 And then the final thing I want to say is that no matter what, you're going to need 314 00:18:59,540 --> 00:19:01,820 thick skin to move through the system. 315 00:19:01,820 --> 00:19:05,240 So you're going to be able, you're going to need to stand up for yourself. 316 00:19:05,240 --> 00:19:09,720 You're going to need to recognize that there are always going to be people within the system 317 00:19:09,720 --> 00:19:14,880 who don't stand up for themselves, who don't say, no, that rule doesn't make sense for 318 00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:15,880 us. 319 00:19:15,880 --> 00:19:16,880 We're not going to do that. 320 00:19:16,880 --> 00:19:18,040 This is how we're going to do it. 321 00:19:18,040 --> 00:19:21,120 There'll always be people who are like, no, no, no, no, no, just keep your head down. 322 00:19:21,120 --> 00:19:22,120 Just, just do it. 323 00:19:22,120 --> 00:19:24,000 No, they say you should be in my chart all day. 324 00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:25,240 You better be in my chart all day. 325 00:19:25,240 --> 00:19:28,500 And then you just do the work in the middle of the night when nobody else is looking. 326 00:19:28,500 --> 00:19:30,280 And it may be working for them. 327 00:19:30,280 --> 00:19:35,000 But if it's not working for you, you don't have to go with that flow, but recognize that 328 00:19:35,000 --> 00:19:39,560 the moment you make a different choice, you are not going to be liked by the people who 329 00:19:39,560 --> 00:19:42,260 have decided not to make that choice. 330 00:19:42,260 --> 00:19:44,600 And you've got to be okay with that. 331 00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:50,800 So if you're going to make changes that allow you to create space for your scholarship, 332 00:19:50,800 --> 00:19:54,480 you're going to need to have thick skin and you're going to need to recognize that you're 333 00:19:54,480 --> 00:19:57,520 going to be doing things differently from some people around you. 334 00:19:57,520 --> 00:19:59,520 And it's okay. 335 00:19:59,520 --> 00:20:01,920 And this is where community comes in, right? 336 00:20:01,920 --> 00:20:05,840 People who are doing what you're doing or moving around in the system the same way you're 337 00:20:05,840 --> 00:20:12,080 moving through the system so that you know that even if at your local institution, things, 338 00:20:12,080 --> 00:20:15,920 you know, are not necessarily, you're not supported to do that way, to do things that 339 00:20:15,920 --> 00:20:20,160 way, then you have a bigger community that supports you to do that. 340 00:20:20,160 --> 00:20:21,160 Okay. 341 00:20:21,160 --> 00:20:25,560 So the first thing I said is to recognize that the rules are agnostic to your needs. 342 00:20:25,560 --> 00:20:26,920 This is summarizing everything. 343 00:20:26,920 --> 00:20:29,920 Number two, the system is really not built to care for you. 344 00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:32,880 It's not built to really meet your needs. 345 00:20:32,880 --> 00:20:36,920 Number three, the person best equipped to handle your needs is you. 346 00:20:36,920 --> 00:20:41,000 Number four, if you cannot make headway, it's an opportunity to reach out to your mentors 347 00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:42,400 to support you. 348 00:20:42,400 --> 00:20:46,940 Number five, carefully craft the career you want so you can decide how you show up in 349 00:20:46,940 --> 00:20:48,260 your career. 350 00:20:48,260 --> 00:20:52,680 Number seven, help your senior leaders understand why it is best to support you. 351 00:20:52,680 --> 00:20:53,680 That was number six. 352 00:20:53,680 --> 00:20:56,400 And then number seven, you're going to need thick skin to move through the system because 353 00:20:56,400 --> 00:20:59,280 no matter what, you're going to be doing things differently from people around you. 354 00:20:59,280 --> 00:21:02,800 You're going to want to be feel like you're supported to do that. 355 00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:03,800 Okay. 356 00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:08,120 So I want to invite you this week to think about some requirements that you've been invited 357 00:21:08,120 --> 00:21:11,600 to take on that don't actually help you. 358 00:21:11,600 --> 00:21:13,360 They don't meet your needs personally. 359 00:21:13,360 --> 00:21:15,520 They don't meet your needs emotionally. 360 00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:20,840 Maybe you're being asked to lead a meeting that starts at 6 p.m. and daycare closes at 361 00:21:20,840 --> 00:21:21,840 6 p.m. 362 00:21:21,840 --> 00:21:27,840 And you know that you can't afford to not take your kids out of daycare on time. 363 00:21:27,840 --> 00:21:29,560 You know, those kinds of things. 364 00:21:29,560 --> 00:21:36,640 What opportunities do you have to change, to actually address those requirements that 365 00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:40,120 may not be meeting your needs today? 366 00:21:40,120 --> 00:21:44,120 And so I invite you to just think creatively about how can you do that? 367 00:21:44,120 --> 00:21:48,320 How can you, instead of just saying, okay, I guess I will just pay extra money for an 368 00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:53,440 au pair that picks up the kids at 6 p.m., how can you address the requirements so that 369 00:21:53,440 --> 00:21:56,960 your institution helps you meet your needs? 370 00:21:56,960 --> 00:21:57,960 Right. 371 00:21:57,960 --> 00:22:00,120 I mean, they're not thinking about it, but you are. 372 00:22:00,120 --> 00:22:02,480 Anyway, so that's my call to action this week. 373 00:22:02,480 --> 00:22:06,800 And I'd love to hear about some strategies that you have put in place to do that. 374 00:22:06,800 --> 00:22:07,800 All right. 375 00:22:07,800 --> 00:22:09,520 It's been a pleasure talking with you today. 376 00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:11,560 Thank you so much for listening. 377 00:22:11,560 --> 00:22:23,760 And I look forward to talking with you again the next time. 378 00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:29,080 Thanks for listening to this episode of the Clinician Researcher Podcast, where academic 379 00:22:29,080 --> 00:22:34,280 clinicians learn the skills to build their own research program, whether or not they 380 00:22:34,280 --> 00:22:35,920 have a mentor. 381 00:22:35,920 --> 00:22:41,280 If you found the information in this episode to be helpful, don't keep it all to yourself. 382 00:22:41,280 --> 00:22:43,760 Someone else needs to hear it. 383 00:22:43,760 --> 00:22:47,800 So take a minute right now and share it. 384 00:22:47,800 --> 00:22:53,280 As you share this episode, you become part of our mission to help launch a new generation 385 00:22:53,280 --> 00:23:12,080 of clinician researchers who make transformative discoveries that change the way we do healthcare.