Transcript
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Welcome to the Clinician Researcher podcast, where academic clinicians learn the skills
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to build their own research program, whether or not they have a mentor.
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As clinicians, we spend a decade or more as trainees learning to take care of patients.
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When we finally start our careers, we want to build research programs, but then we find
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that our years of clinical training did not adequately prepare us to lead our research
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program.
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Through no fault of our own, we struggle to find mentors, and when we can't, we quit.
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However, clinicians hold the keys to the greatest research breakthroughs.
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For this reason, the Clinician Researcher podcast exists to give academic clinicians
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the tools to build their own research program, whether or not they have a mentor.
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Now introducing your host, Toyosi Onwuemene.
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Welcome to today's podcast episode.
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I'm your host Toyosi Onwuemene, and it is such a privilege to be talking to you today on
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the Clinician Researcher podcast.
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Welcome.
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Today, I am continuing this series this week of no and yes.
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I started out the day before with why you should say no.
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And then yesterday, I talked about how to say no.
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So why to say no, how to say no.
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And today, I'm talking to you about why you should say yes.
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And I hear you saying, what?
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You said I should say no, and now you're asking me to say yes?
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Oh, yes, yes.
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I definitely am asking you to say yes.
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Today, I'm asking you to say yes.
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And let's talk about it.
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So one of the things I talked about, one of the things I talked about that I think is
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important that we revisit every time is that whenever you say yes, you're also saying no.
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Because you're a finite person, you've got a specific number of hours in a day, and your
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day is probably already committed.
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And the moment you say yes to something, what it has to do in order for you to make that
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yes happen is to display something else.
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You've got to say no to something else.
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And so if you're already scheduled to be somewhere at 6.30 PM, and an urgent, very critical,
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nobody can miss it departmental meeting gets called at 6.30, in order for you to make the
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departmental meeting, you have to say no to the prior engagement.
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And so in saying yes to one, you say no to the other.
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And the challenge for us in academic medicine is that the yes feels pretty easy right this
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moment.
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Because more hidden are the things that we're saying no to.
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And for people who successfully say no, it's because they understand what the yeses are,
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that they are not willing to say no to by saying yes to something new.
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And so no and yes always get together.
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They are two sides of the same coin.
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No and yes always get together.
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They are two sides of the same coin.
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Which is why whenever I ask you to say no, what I'm really asking you to do is say yes
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and vice versa.
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Because you say no to one thing, you're saying yes to another.
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And if you say yes to something, you're saying no to the other.
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And so today I'm here to really talk about why we should say yes.
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Why we should say yes.
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So it's funny sometimes and you may have experienced this.
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You'll go to a place and you'll hear someone like me say, always say no, say no, say no,
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say no.
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And to be honest, most of the time if you're in doubt, best to say no.
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If you are in doubt, just say no.
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If you're saying no out of fear, that's another thing.
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And we'll talk a little bit about that today.
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But if you are like, I'm not sure what to say, say no.
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And the reason you want to say no is you want to take time to say yes.
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So many times when we say yes, we feel like, well, there's no good reason to say no.
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But really what we should do is flip it.
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Is flip it.
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Is to say, why should I say yes?
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And we're like, is this opportunity so important that I should say yes to it?
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And so we're going to talk about clarifying our yes and why we say yes.
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OK.
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We can talk about five reasons today for which you should say yes.
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Five reasons why you should say yes.
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OK.
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So we're clinician scientists, right?
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That's my audience here.
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And perhaps you're listening or not a clinician scientist.
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There is a thing that is really important to you to advance.
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The thing that if you don't do, nobody else will do.
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It's not to say that the problem won't be solved, but your flavor, your solution, the
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unique perspective you bring to that solution will not move forward except you move it forward.
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Let's for example, say Steve Jobs was like, you know what?
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I don't really want to do this Apple computers thing.
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I don't even know where it's going to go.
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I'm not going to do it.
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Where would the world be today?
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The world would be without Steve Jobs and Apple.
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Now, would the world advance?
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It totally would.
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Somebody else at some point would have discovered some of the things that he did.
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In fact, there have been computer companies around for a long time, right?
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If there was no Apple, they would still probably be a Microsoft.
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There probably would still be a Lenovo.
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And so there are all these companies that would still exist kind of providing the same
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service.
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But what would be missing is the unique flavor that someone like Steve Jobs brought.
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Right.
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He was able to create a company that was unique because of the kind of person that he was.
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It's the same thing about your research.
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Okay, you may be working in diabetes research and to be honest, there were a lot of researchers
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in that space, but what you bring to the table is not replaceable.
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It's just not because it's you and the questions that you have are different from the questions
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other people have.
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The things that you feel like are most important are different from what other people feel
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are important.
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The reasons you come to your science are different from other people as well.
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And so what I'm talking about saying yes to first and foremost is the work that you can
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do to move your ideas, your impact forward.
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Because when we really stop to think about it, this is really about impact.
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This is really about contribution.
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This is really about a sense of purpose.
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That's what this is about.
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We're not just doing research to say, I did research.
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We're not doing research to say, okay, will you promote me now?
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And if you're doing that, I'm just going to invite you to please reconsider.
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Don't do, I mean, I want to just say, I have to go back now and tell you and remind you
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how hard it has been to be in medicine.
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It's been fun.
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It's been awesome.
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I've been with patients, but it can be super hard.
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And if you were looking for easier things to do in life, you could totally go do that.
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And so you've done a lot of hard things in medicine and it's time to do things that give
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you a sense of energy and purpose and help you feel like you're contributing.
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And so for how hard we work, for the things that we do, it is really important that you
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do the things that really serve you, that really help you move forward.
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And yes, I know that in life we may never be able to completely get rid of the things
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we do out of obligation, but I'm going to say the further you are from your training,
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the fewer things you should be doing out of a sense of obligation.
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So the work you do is really because you've come to have impact.
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It's really because you want to make a difference.
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For that reason, that work is important.
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If you do not come to it, if you don't move the work forward, it likely will not move
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forward in the way that you're going to move it forward.
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It will not have the kind of impact that you would have brought to it.
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For that reason, you should say yes.
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The thing you should absolutely always say yes to is your scientific career.
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Because as a clinician scientist, you are always on the verge of breakthrough.
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And it doesn't ever feel like breakthrough because you know that then there's a next
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breakthrough, there's a next breakthrough after that.
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And sometimes the breakthroughs look like one grant to the next grant to the next grant.
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It's like one rejected manuscript to the next rejection to the next rejection.
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It doesn't feel like a breakthrough.
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You're always on the verge of the breakthrough because small increments lead you closer to
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where you want to be.
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And sometimes we criticize scientists who are like, oh, this is incremental.
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In reality, all of life is incremental.
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Even when you're taking giant steps, you can only take a small step and then the next step
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and then the next step.
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And wow, a couple of steps later, it is a giant step.
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But it always starts small.
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So I want to say the very, very, very first thing you want to say yes to is your work,
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your work, not somebody else's work.
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And this is where it can be challenging when we have research mentors and we're helping
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and moving their work forward.
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Ultimately, our goal is to come into our own.
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And so your mentor's work cannot take precedence over your work if you're clear about what
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your work is.
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And yes, it may be that for a season, your work and your mentor's work overlap until
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you separate and become who you are.
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But ultimately, your purpose is to stand as your own independent scientist.
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And so advancing the knowledge from the perspective that you bring is so key.
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It is the one thing you should always say yes to.
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Okay, that's number one.
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Number two is you should say yes to improving patient outcomes.
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I want to say that again.
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You should say yes to improving patient outcomes.
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And sometimes you do it through your work, through your research.
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Many of us do it through our research.
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Like our research is really founded on improving patients' lives, improving patient care.
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And your improving patient outcomes could be your clinical work.
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And so as a clinician scientist, you probably are still seeing patients in one shape or
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another, and advancing patient care is important.
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So you should say yes to improving patient outcomes.
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But here's the thing you should not say yes to, busy work that looks like patient care.
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So let's take a step back and recognize that to care for a patient well, a lot is needed.
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Time is needed to spend on the phone with insurance companies.
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Time is needed to follow up lab results.
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Time is needed to call patients.
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And sometimes you play phone tag.
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And those are all important things.
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However, not all those important things need to be done by you.
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Not all those important things need to be done by you.
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And here's the challenge.
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The more you do these important things that are not supposed to be done by you, the less
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you can do the important things that only you can do.
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And so I want you to say yes to improving patient outcomes, but no to the things that
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actually diminish your ability to do that.
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And you may be asking, yeah, how do I do that?
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That's super hard.
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And I don't have all the answers.
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I'm not really here to tell you I have all the answers.
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I'm still figuring it out myself.
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But how do you shrink all the busy work that masquerades as patient care so that you can
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really do the work of advancing patient outcomes?
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And so say yes to patient outcomes.
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And because you're going to improve patient outcomes by saying yes to improving them,
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what are you going to drop so you can do that well?
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For example, if you in a half day of clinic are able to see, let's say, 10 patients,
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returns, mix of returns and news, whatever, you're able to see 10 patients.
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That's your highest priority.
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And the things that lead you away from caring for those 10 patients, not as important.
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And here invariably is what happens.
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You get three phone calls of someone who's waiting on lab orders to be released and know
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it has to be done now because the patient is waiting.
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And oh, did you hear that that critical lab result just got called in, but they didn't
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give you a phone number.
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So now you have to play page or phone tag.
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All those things are distractions from your ability to move patient care forward.
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And I want you to think critically about how you make them smaller for you so that you
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can do the real work of seeing patients, of enhancing patient outcomes, especially through
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your research as a clinician scientist.
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And even when you're in the clinic, making sure that you have the resources that you
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need to support these important things that need to happen, but may not need to be done
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by you.
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OK.
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So that's number two.
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Number three is to say yes to your career growth and development.
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If it moves you forward, if it helps you learn a new technique, a new way of thinking, a
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new way of being, a new way of doing, say yes to it.
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If it comes to career growth and development, you definitely say yes.
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You make space so that you can grow.
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Because here's the thing.
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You've heard that quote, and I think it came from Abraham Lincoln, but maybe it came from
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someone else before him.
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It says, if you ask me to chop down a tree, I'm going to first of all spend like most
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of the time sharpening the axe before I cut the tree.
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Career growth and development, professional development opportunities, that's you sharpening
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the axe.
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That's you saying I'm about to get better because the moment I get better, everything
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gets better.
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You always say yes to career growth and development.
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Always say yes.
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Now, there are three offerings all happening at the same time, which are going to stretch
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you to the max.
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Well, yes, you say yes, but not all at the same time.
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You choose the one that makes the most sense for you right now, and you say yes to the
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other ones at a later time.
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So yes, it is possible that some people overwhelm themselves with so many career growth and
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professional development opportunities.
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I may be one of those people secretly in hiding, but they are important because they help you
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grow and because they do, you say yes to them and you find a way to make it work because
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the moment you sharpen your focus, the moment you learn to manage time better, the moment
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you learn to prioritize what is most important, your life changes and the lives of everybody
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around you changes as well.
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And so yes, yes, yes, yes to career growth and development.
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Okay, number four.
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Number four is saying yes to new relationships.
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Saying yes to new relationships.
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There is a famous quote, and I don't know who said it.
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If I find it, I will put it in the show notes.
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But there's a famous quote about the three things that are so important in life are the
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people you meet, the places you go and the books you read.
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And at the end of the day, I would say that it's really just one thing that's most important.
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It's the people you meet, right?
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You may meet people in person or you may go to places where other people like you have
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solved problems in a different way.
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We all have similar problems, but when we travel to different places, we see how other
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people have solved them.
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So it's still the common denominator, still people.
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And then when you read books, it is people who've put these books together.
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Therefore, the common denominator again is people.
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People will change your life.
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People will take you to the next level.
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People will enhance your research.
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Collaborations are amazing when they're with the right people.
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And so meeting people, enhancing your relationships is something you should totally say yes to.
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And here's the thing.
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You always want to say yes to these network opportunities, networking opportunities that
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happen outside your institution.
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I'm not saying there's anything wrong with being friends with the people at your institution
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or establishing collaborations within your institution.
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There's so many amazing collaborations to be had at your own institution.
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However, there's a bigger bang for your buck when you go outside.
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The reason being is that the people in your institution think a certain way.
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It's like the fish in the water.
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You're like, wait, what water?
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Right?
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You're surrounded by water.
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And so you don't think much of the water.
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And that's the same thing with your institutional culture.
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There's a way you all think that's very, very similar.
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And so if you're going to have the kind of collaborative relationship that transforms
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your thinking, you go to a place where the culture is different.
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And that is why meeting people and say, I tried not to say the networking word that
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makes everybody so worried and anxious and afraid.
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It really is just about relationships.
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It really is.
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And how do you build relationships?
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You don't always have to go to conferences and look for people's cards to be handed
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out to you when you volunteer to be on committees or you whatever opportunity you have to connect
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with people, take it.
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And don't think about it as, oh, gosh, I've got to network because the energy that that
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brings is no good for relationships.
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I mean, really, you meet someone who's like, oh, my goodness, I have to talk to you.
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And tell me how far that relationship is going to go.
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Tell me how far that relationship is going to go.
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Right.
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Ultimately, you do want to connect with people, whatever you want to call it to make it feel
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more palatable.
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You should.
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But meeting people is so important.
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OK.
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So always say yes to new relationships because what they do is they expand your horizons.
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They make you a better person.
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All right.
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Number five is saying yes to the future.
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Saying yes to you, your future, your legacy.
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It's saying yes to that.
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It's saying yes to yourself 40 years from now.
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And you look back and say, I made these choices.
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I am grateful for the choices I made.
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And the reason we want to make sure that we're clearly saying yes to our future self is because
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many of the relationships we neglect today are critical to that future self.
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And so on the path to research success, on the path to academic success, what we never
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want to do is to neglect the relationships that are so easy to take for granted.
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We don't want to neglect the relationships with our bodies because our bodies 40 years
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from now are going to be looking at us saying, this is what you did.
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This is how you did.
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We're experiencing this together.
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40 years from now, your children are going to say, I don't remember.
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I just don't remember you at home ever.
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40 years from now, maybe they're going to be grandchildren who say, I don't really know
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grandpa because my dad doesn't really get along well with grandpa.
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Right?
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What you want to do is look to the future and say yes to your legacy.
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And these are the things that are so important to consider as we are considering our careers
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is to be so clear about what this yes is so that we're not confused when other nos come
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in to try to steal it from us.
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So just to summarize, number one is to say yes to your work, your work of advancing scientific
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knowledge, the work that's you, that's uniquely you.
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Say yes to improving patient outcomes.
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Say yes to helping the patient, but don't accept the yes of the stuff that's busy work
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that's not directly related to patient care.
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Say yes, but see who else can help you say yes to those other things that are not exclusively
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the things that you can do.
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Say yes to your career growth and development.
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That's number three, because as you transform, all your life transforms alongside it.
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Number four is to say yes to new relationships because networking is so important because
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it expands your horizons and it's important to make sure you're doing it outside of your
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institution.
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And number five is saying yes to the future, saying yes to the legacy that you're going
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to leave behind.
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And it's going to be a healthy legacy.
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It's going to be healthy in terms of your finances.
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I didn't even talk about that.
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It's going to be healthy in terms of your personal relationships right now that are
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easy to take for granted.
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And it's also going to be healthy in terms of your relationship to your body.
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All right.
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Somebody else needs to hear this podcast episode and you should share it with them.
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And if you are looking for a coach who can help you navigate as you build your career
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and as a clinician scientist, I would love to work with you.
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You should send me a DM.
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Better still, leave a voicemail on our podcast website, clinicianresearcherpodcast.com.
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Share something insightful that comes to you at the end of listening to this episode so
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that I can incorporate it into a future episode.
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All right.
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It's been a pleasure talking with you today.
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I look forward to speaking with you again the next time.
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Thanks for listening to this episode of the Clinician Researcher Podcast where academic
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clinicians learn the skills to build their own research program, whether or not they
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have a mentor.
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If you found the information in this episode to be helpful, don't keep it all to yourself.
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Someone else needs to hear it.
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So take a minute right now and share it.
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As you share this episode, you become part of our mission to help launch a new generation
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of clinician researchers who make transformative discoveries that change the way we do healthcare.